Kalib Stevens 0:00

People aren't going to adopt what they don't understand. So everyone has a phone. And your grandparents can send a text. So when you look at the life wallet, it's communication forward, where you're taking that idea that everyone is familiar with sending a text using your phone.

Welcome And Guest Background

Joeri Billast 0:23

Hello everyone, and welcome to the Web3 CMO Stories Podcast. My name is Joeri Billast. I'm your podcast host. And today I'm honored to be joined by Kalib. Hi Kalib, how are you? Thanks for having me. Guys, I have Kalib Stevens on the podcast. He is responsible for corporate communications at RYO in Japan. You're the third person coming on the podcast from RYO, Kalib. RYO is our main podcast sponsor for this year, and they are also sponsoring my Synergist Retweet, which is coming up next week. But for our listeners, Kalib, and for me, maybe in a few sentences, can you introduce yourself a bit?

Kalib Stevens 1:06

Sure. My name is Kalib Stevens. I'm from Florida in America. I've been with the RYO project for a little over a year now, and I'm really excited to be talking to you today.

Helping Creators Actually Use Web3

Joeri Billast 1:17

Yeah. For me also, you know, it's always interesting to hear voices from all over the world. And you are American and you're living now in Japan. Um I like to dive straight in, Kaleb. You started actually, I think, your career or somewhere in your work life by helping artists and creators adopt Web3. What did early experience reveal about the gap between technology and real-world usability?

Kalib Stevens 1:47

I think, especially with artists, musicians, people like that, creative spaces, there's a gap when it comes to where the technology is and where they are, and just trying to sort of bring the technology to them rather than trying to pull them to the technology. Because it's very utilitarian. They need to know what's the benefit for me? How is this going to help me get more views, get more fans? What can Web3 do for me rather than what can I do for Web3?

What Gaming Teaches About Retention

Joeri Billast 2:26

Absolutely. That's a good statement, actually. I never heard that way. So, Kalib, after your move to Japan and deeper involvement in gaming and virtual worlds, how did your perspective on adoption and user behavior evolve?

Kalib Stevens 2:42

So when I think of the user behavior, especially in gaming and virtual worlds, as it's sort of shifted towards a free-to-play model where the top games out right now are free to play for anyone, people really value the time that they're putting into it rather than any monetary value, since they can just jump from one game to another. And I sort of think about that in the lens of crypto as well in Web3, where sort of everything is free to get into. You can just download any wallet app. You can go into Phantom, MetaMask, or the Life Wallet. And you really have to set yourself apart. You have to think how is this app different from another one? Especially because there's no risk to just saying, oh, the app's not for me, the game's not for me, I'll just jump to the next one. So I think it's really user behavior is about figuring out what can set them apart for maintaining and retaining your users.

Joeri Billast 3:59

Yeah, that that's uh a good point. Because many wallets today still feel complex, still feel intimidating, but you believe is fundamentally broken in the current user experience.

The Wallet UX Problem Explained

Kalib Stevens 4:13

Yeah, I think the root problem is really information overload. You download a wallet app and it's just a barrage of crypto jargon that if you're just getting into cryptocurrency and you're Googling, how should I start? And people tell you, well, the first thing you need to do is download a wallet. You do that, and it's just words you've never seen before. And when it comes to crypto, if you make a mistake, even the smallest thing, your money's gone. There's no take backs. So I think that people are really intimidated by the permanence of any mistakes and also the overload of information. So I think that's why we've aligned with the life wallet, is because they've really streamlined the experience to make sure that the space is more user-friendly, more people forward, and making sure that it's crypto for anyone. There's not technical jargon, it's all very streamlined step by step.

Joeri Billast 5:22

Yeah, I love that. I am an early live wallet user, ambassador Europe. Before we dive a bit further into the live wallet, I want to zoom out a bit. Is the real problem technology, or is it how we design interactions and expectations for the users?

Kalib Stevens 5:38

Yeah, I wouldn't say the problem is technology because if you really think about it, any digital technology is a series of ones and zeros. And the end user isn't going to see that. What actually matters is the user interface, the user experience. Like if you think about Apple products, you can take it out of its white box and you know what you're doing. They've perfected the user interface and user experience so that uh the technology works for you. So the basic philosophy needs to be that it just works. And that's really what's missing in the Web3 space is that philosophy of it just works.

Why Messaging Drives Adoption

Joeri Billast 6:30

People are intimidated just by hearing the word Web3 already. It's interesting when I talk to my girlfriend about it. She says, What is Web3 again? She knows what AI is because everyone is talking about it. But on Web3. Now let's let's dive a bit more into the lifelot uses a more communication-driven approach, which I truth interesting. Why do you believe messaging is such a powerful gateway into digital finance?

Kalib Stevens 6:59

Yeah, I really think that adoption is rooted in familiarity. People aren't going to adopt what they don't understand. So everyone has a phone, and your grandparents can send a text. So when you look at the life wallet, it's communication forward where you're taking that idea that everyone is familiar with, sending a text, using your phone, and integrating Web3 and crypto wallets into that. You're meeting someone where they are rather than expecting them to go the extra mile and get there. And so that's really the philosophy is that we want to see how people are interacting with technology and making sure that we are meeting them where they are rather than making them do the work, do the homework to meet us.

Joeri Billast 7:58

Yeah, that's a good statement because if we want people to start using these wallets, indeed you need to go towards them and not the other way around. When when you think about first-time users, what are the exact moments where they typically drop off? And how would you redesign those moments?

Kalib Stevens 8:19

Yeah, I think the exact moment in any sort of technology that a new user would drop off is when they see an unfamiliar phrase or an unfamiliar concept, and there's no explanation for it. And especially in like a crypto wallet where, you know, it's your money that you're thinking of. If you have an unfamiliar concept and it's not being explained to you properly, then people are just going to delete the app. They're going to say, I can't do this, I don't want to risk it. And so that's why we've aligned with the life wallet for our ecosystem is to guide users step by step so that they can integrate into the crypto space and secure their digital funds. We need to make sure that everything is user-forward.

Making Addresses Simple Without Risk

Joeri Billast 9:14

Yeah, absolutely. And then another hurdle is, Kalib, is in is the long wallet addresses that can create both friction, both risk, maybe stress. How do you simplify that without compromising trust and security?

Kalib Stevens 9:29

Yeah, the way I think about it is you're using a computer right now, right? Uh, can you tell me off the top of your head what the serial number is on your computer?

Joeri Billast 9:40

No idea.

Kalib Stevens 9:42

No idea, right? But no one would. No one has that memorized, no one has that readily available. But all of a sudden, when we're doing cryptocurrency, all of a sudden people have these long wallet addresses that look like a serial number, and we're expecting people to write it down, copy and paste it, make sure everything is perfect about it. And so if you look at a wallet address like that, adoption's gonna be hard. And you don't have to say it on air, but I bet you know your email address, you know your email password, right? You have those in your mind, and you can easily get it. And I'm sure you have two-factor authentication on your email. So we've simplified it down to an email, and you still have all that security that a wallet address would have. All you've changed is how easily accessible it is for the average person. You haven't sacrificed anything in terms of your security by having an email address and password and two-factor authentication.

Joeri Billast 10:59

Makes me think also of something and two-factor authentication. You have it on many apps, um, which is important for security. Do you see wallets evolving into something closer to everyday apps? And if so, what will users stop thinking about altogether?

Kalib Stevens 11:19

Yeah, that's the mindset that I want for crypto apps and web 3 is that it's for everyone. And I don't want people to have the mindset of I've got my regular apps and then I have my wallet app or my crypto app. Because when I'm looking at my bank account app on my phone, I don't think, okay, I need to set aside time so I can really understand my bank app. I need to go through all the features and make sure I've got it right. That's not the mindset people really have for just your everyday applications. But then once they get into their crypto wallet, you say, okay, I need to really do my homework and make sure everything is good. So I think that's the mindset change that needs to happen is viewing it like any other app. And I think the way to do that is through accessibility and making sure that all of the complicated crypto jargon has been smoothed out so that people really can adopt crypto.

Joeri Billast 12:30

You already mentioned it, huh? But Web3 products still expect users to adapt to the system. How important is it to design systems that adapt to people instead?

Kalib Stevens 12:43

Right. It's like I was saying earlier, the whole RYO project is about crypto for everyone and making sure that any person is able to properly access and dip their feet into Web3 wherever they're at, as far as understanding technology, where you do have the people who are really deep diving into cryptography and everything. And then you have just your everyday person who doesn't understand it, but they want to be a part of it. And I think it's important to be able to facilitate that.

Crypto For Everyone In Practice

Joeri Billast 13:21

Yeah, absolutely. You mentioned It RYO positions itself around crypto for everyone. From your perspective, what needs to change for that vision, because it's a big vision, to actually become uh become a reality.

Kalib Stevens 13:37

Yeah, I think the big shift that needs to happen is for people to understand that crypto can be safe and secure and reliable, and that it's not a whole another world that is separate from them. Like I think about people who they want to invest in the stock market. You know, they think, oh, I don't know anything about that. I'm just I have some money squared away, I'm gonna use that money and hire someone who can help me with my investments. I think that's not where crypto should be. I think it should be for every person. And that comes down to breaking down the rough edges and making sure that there's proper step-by-step guidance to understanding. And that's why we've aligned with the Life Wallet and integrated the Life Wallet, because it has that step-by-step guide into properly getting your wallet set up.

Joeri Billast 14:46

Yeah, I love that. And what you also mentioned, or what I also know about the Life Wallet, is that it is starting integration, integrating communication and social elements. And then I'm wondering how do you ensure they stay useful instead of becoming distracting or noisy?

Kalib Stevens 15:08

Yeah, I think the big thing is understanding what the key feature of a wallet is. And if you think about a regular wallet, a physical wallet that you put in your bag or your pocket, when you go to the store, you're looking at all the different options. You're comparing, okay, this one has this type of leather, but none of those things matter if you put your card in the wallet and it can just slip right out. You know, it doesn't matter how nice the leather is if it's not securely holding your money. So I think the root idea and core understanding of it is that your wallet should be the simplest, best place to hold your money, to hold your digital currency. And so that's why we've aligned with LifeWallet because it is secure, it's simple, and it takes care of your funds, while on top of that, having the social elements and the communication elements in service of the wallet, rather than the wallet being in service of the extra elements.

Joeri Billast 16:29

Yeah, you mentioned make it as simple as possible. How does it look like the onboarding flow for someone completely new to crypto? How does the onboarding flow look like for the life wallets? And is it for you the way to onboard new users?

Revival Manga And Where To Start

Kalib Stevens 16:46

Yeah, I think about it like how you teach someone to ride a bike. You know, you're not gonna jump in there and say, okay, this is how you shift gears, this is how you uh choose the right frame and the right saddle. You know, the person that you're teaching isn't there yet. You need to teach them, these are the handlebars, these are the brakes, this is how you steer. And so that's the great thing about the Life Wallet is that it is like teaching someone how to ride a bike. It has it step by step, starting from the very beginning, basic building blocks, and then working your way up into having your currency and being able to send that to a person through a message and through the communication aspect of it. And that's really the experience we're trying to work towards is having it so people aren't getting overwhelmed by trying to be a part of this crypto space, is having it step by step, learning how to ride a bike and getting people integrated. And that's the whole message of the RYO project is we meet people where they are so that we can introduce them and make sure crypto actually is for everyone.

Joeri Billast 18:13

Yeah, thanks, Kayleigh. There is indeed RYO is an ecosystem. Many parts of it today we focus a bit on the life wallet. There will be some other episodes on the podcast later this year. But I'm now seeing your beautiful background. And at the end of this podcast episode, can you explain a bit what this is about, the revival?

Kalib Stevens 18:34

So Revival is the Revival manga project where manga is Japanese comic books. And so we've partnered with very famous manga artists here in Japan, and we've been bringing the RYO story to life through the pages to show the history of RYO as the first currency and how that integrates into where currency is now. So it's a real exciting story. It's currently only in Japanese, but an English translation will be coming out very soon.

Joeri Billast 19:12

I just needed to ask a question, Kalib, when I saw it. Um, if people are interested in exploring the life wallet, uh, where would you like me to send them? Kalib, there are show notes, there is an article related to this podcast episode. You will be able to find the links in there. It's also on the side menu on my website, on my blog. Thank you so much, Kalib. It was really a pleasure to have you on the show. Yeah, thanks for having me. What an insightful episode. I'm sure you know people around you also want to learn about crypto for the masters or interested in exploring crypto. So be sure to share this episode with them. If you're not yet following the show, this is a really good moment to do this. Hit the subscribe button. If you haven't given me a video yet, this is also very, very helpful for me. If you give me these 5 stars, this really goes a long way. And of course, I would like to see you back next time. Take care.

Kalib Stevens 20:27

Thank you.